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Superbird v. Daytona ... difference?

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  • Member since
    November, 2006
  • From: Lake Villa, IL
Superbird v. Daytona ... difference?
Posted by vwdave92 on Monday, September 10, 2007 10:31 AM
Hey Mopar guys and gals...

I'm out of my norm wanting to build a Superbird but it's for my 2yo daughter... the car just fits her personality.

So i need some help on a couple of things.

first... all I can find are daytona kits. Is there a SB kit or is the dayton close enough? If Dayton is the way to go are the cosmetic changes besides badges? (I have a line on some very good SB graphics)

two... there is a factory Mopar pink from that era... I believe it's called tiger pink in the Testors two part laquer line. Was that a factory SB color? Is there a factory SB pink?

Thanks in advance for the help and I promise to post pictures of the finished car as pay back Big Smile

Dave

on the bench: Revell 49 Merc... most ambitious project yet...

Support your LHS! Greenfield News and Hobby: Greenfield, WI; Model Empire: West Allis, WI; Ron's Hobbies: Mundelein, IL

  • Member since
    February, 2007
  • From: Sidney BC
Posted by Raydee53 on Monday, September 10, 2007 10:46 AM
There is a Superbird kit out there,I can't remember who produced it but I am sure it was revell or amt.The detail level is not that great,Not on par with the newer Daytona.The difference between the SB and the Daytona is that the SB is a Plymouth Roadrunner and the Daytona is a Dodge Charger.Panther Pink was a Factory dodge color but I don't Know if it was a color for the SB.SAE mag did an article on Dodge and Plymouth Factory colors a while back.
"Never tell me the odds"-Han Solo "He was a loser, you know. Every high school has to have at least two: it's like a national law. One male, one female. Everyone's dumping ground." - Christine, narration, Prologue
  • Member since
    February, 2007
  • From: Sidney BC
Posted by Raydee53 on Monday, September 10, 2007 10:49 AM
Though I am by no means an authoritative figure on Mopars.I build mostly chevys and lowriders ,etc.
"Never tell me the odds"-Han Solo "He was a loser, you know. Every high school has to have at least two: it's like a national law. One male, one female. Everyone's dumping ground." - Christine, narration, Prologue
  • Member since
    September, 2006
  • From: Savannah
Posted by zgator on Monday, September 10, 2007 10:51 AM
The color you are asking about is called Panther Pink. I don't think it was avaiable on the SB and the Daytona. I've never seen one.
82 Collector Ed Corvette (Fast!!!). Black on black 81 Corvette she's a nasty girl that likes a good spanking. (Quick!!!) I always tell the truth even when I lie
  • Member since
    May, 2008
Posted by Anonymous on Monday, September 10, 2007 11:05 AM
the Superbird kit was done by Monogram and is a nice kit. it is a little simplified in some areas, but builds up quite nicely. the Superbird could have been available in Panther pink, the Daytona, no, it was a 1970 color.
Dave
  • Member since
    December, 2004
  • From: Umeå Sweden
Posted by Force on Monday, September 10, 2007 11:23 AM
Well when you see them at a distance they might look alike but there is quite a lot that differs when you study them more up close and have both beside eachother.
The Superbird is based on the 1970 Plymouth Road Runner and the Daytona on the 1969 Dodge Charger and the only thing they really have in common is the chassis and drive train.
The nosecone is different in shape, on the Daytona the cone slopes more downward than the Superbird.
And the wing struts has differnet angles, the ones on the Daytona is more upright than the ones on the Superbird.
There are also other things but these are the most obvious.

Håkan Persson Sweden

John Force 16X NHRA Funny Car Champion

  • Member since
    November, 2003
Posted by MLOMAKA on Monday, September 10, 2007 11:55 AM
Yes, R/M did the SB.There are several differences between the two that would make getting the SB kit required. If I remember correctly, the SB was based on the roadrunner, while the Daytona was based on the Charger with Coronet front fenders. Also, if I remember correctly, all Daytonas have vinyl tops to cover the plug in the rear window, where SBs did not have to have the tops, but many did.
Mike member of Buckeye Scale Auto Club http://community.webshots.com/user/mlomaka http://s5.photobucket.com/albums/y184/mlomaka/ http://www.hubgarage.com/mygarage/mlomaka
  • Member since
    May, 2008
Posted by Anonymous on Monday, September 10, 2007 1:01 PM
All 1969 Dodge Charger Daytona's did not have vinyl roof's, while all Plymouth Road Runner Superbirds had a vinyl roof...they were in a hurry and very concerned about expenses...to have the vehicles ready for the showrooms and to qualify for the racing season. (The Daytona had more development time...hence the properly filled in rear window plug.) The vinyl roof covered up the unsightly area where the revised rear window "cap or "plug" fit the body, and it saved the Plymouth Division the expense of filling and finishing the seams. The only vinyl roof color available on the car was Black (sales code V1X). The instrument panel has revisions between 1969 and 1970, and is not the same as the Daytona. I'm not going to list all of the sales codes that had to be used to order the basic car (why...we are talking about model cars?!), but will list a few thing that were NOT available on these cars. They are: rear seat speaker or speakers, Airtemp Air Conditioning, "Air Grabber "cold air induction package, Sill Moldings, Light Package, Rear Window Defogger, Performance Hood Stripes, Headlamp Delay, Basic Group, Sure Grip Differential, Axle package, Trailer Towing Package. (Only the "Performance Axle Package" on Torqueflite vehicles, or "Track Pak" on 4-Speed vehicles was available in place of the above mentioned Axle Package). Seat availability was limited to black or white bench or bucket seats. Exterior colors WERE RESTRICTED to the following colors only: "Blue Fire Metallic" code B5, "Lime Lite" code J5, Vitamin "C" Orange Metallic code K2, Tor-Red Metallic" code V2, "Alpine White "code W1, "Lemon Twist" code Y1, "Corporate Blue" (not referred to as "Petty Blue" in the literature) code 999. It is reported that a few were painted "Burnt Orange Metallic" code K3, as well. Concering the pinkish color your are mentioning....Plymouth called it "Moulin Rouge" code M3, and it is of a red-pink hue. Only the Dodge Division named it "Panther Pink", same color code. This color was not available on the Superbird, and no records exist that any were built. (It was a 1970 only color, as well.) In my experience with the Testors 2 part "Panther Pink" paint it is NOT a good match to the actual factory color. (strange, as many of there colors are good matches.) I've found "MCW" (Model Car World) color to be a much better match. The information I've presented here has been obtained from my own collection of Chrysler Corp. factory reference material...the 1970 Road Runner Superbird sales folder (that was for dealership use only and not for public release), the 1970 Chrysler-Plymouth Sales Ordering Guide, the 1970 Color and Trim Selector, and the PPG/MCW Automotive Paint Reference Guide. No information was obtained from modern day aftermarket magazines and such (too many errors!Smile,Wink, & Grin) As far as the model kits go, Jo-Han offered an excellent kit of the Superbird in 1970 as well, and it had been re-issued a few times. I've seen them on "Evil-Bay" and at various Toy/Model Shows and internet hobby stores. Keith Marks offers two excellent decals sets for these various kits too. Sorry this is so long winded...hope this helps you! Smile Fury3
  • Member since
    January, 2005
  • From: Thomasville, Ga.
Posted by FreightTrain on Monday, September 10, 2007 2:45 PM
Good job Fury3! Thumbs Up Johan did offer a Plymouth Superbird kit that was very nice and in my opinion better than the Monogram Superbird kit. Only the Monogram kit had the correct vinyl top and the Johan kit was originaly a race car kit, later a Sox & Martin Pro-Stock kit. Both Dodge & Plymouth had to make a certain number of each of these cars in order to race them in Nascar and Dodge did the better job than Plymouth did as all Daytonas look great and that vinyl top on the Plymouths just didn't look 'right', sometimes had a center air bubbles when drove over 70 mph and not to mention caused plenty of rust problems which probably explains why we see more Dodge Daytonas than Plymouth Superbirds still around.
The Daytonas have a excellent racing history record and are usually worth a lot more than the Superbirds. The Revell Daytona kit is outstanding and goes together very well using a lot of the '69 Charger kit parts.
R/M also offered a Pro-Modeler version of the Daytona with a PE grille screen, badges, Nascar tires/wheels, Nascar seat, dash, decals, correct Nascar air cleaner and some other Nascar parts..the option Nascar setup does not include all the correct parts to build one but its a good place to start.
Jeff
~ Jeff Scott ~ "Have You Driven A Ford ... Lately?"
  • Member since
    April, 2007
  • From: Mechanicsburg PA
Posted by DrewLong on Monday, September 10, 2007 3:14 PM
One additional note on the 69 Charger Daytona was based on the Charger 500 which had a "fastback" rear roofline as compared to the standard 69 Charger that had a "tunneled" rear window. the Daytona was an evolution of the Charger 500 which was not aerodynamically sound at high speed (rear end liked to float). An excellent account of NASCAR Mopars can be found in the archives of allpar.com that details the history and development of Mopar's involvment with NASCAR and the R&D that went into the wing cars.
Drew
  • Member since
    November, 2003
  • From: Savannah, GA
Posted by bwmyers18 on Monday, September 10, 2007 5:05 PM
Here's the two side by side ....

  • Member since
    May, 2008
Posted by Anonymous on Monday, September 10, 2007 5:24 PM
Here's the box of my Superbird, I think this is the one Jeff,s talking about ,, it also builds stock. I bought this one new in the early '80's. It's well past due for a rebuild ,, with the AMT '68 RR chassis. Big Smile

  • Member since
    October, 2005
  • From: Antibes FRANCE
Posted by sunny on Monday, September 10, 2007 6:10 PM

Well, a 2 yar-old daughter won't be too sharp on model details LOL

Go with the monogram kit. It' easy to find, cheap and slightly bigger. It's a 440 Six-pack car, not badly reproduced. You can improve it dropping in a 426 Hemi from a Hemicuda, or a 440 4-bbl intake from a 71 Satellite.

To offer your daughter a nicely done Superbird, you'll have to replace the wheels and tires. The from-box Magnum 500 wheels are too large, and the tires ridiculously too narrow. You can use a set of amt 68-69 B-bodies with Monogram GT radial tires. That'll be perfect ! You can also opt for Monogram Rally wheels from a Hemicuda, great choice...

Superbirds were available with either 440 4-bbl, 6 packs or Hemis. Choose the right engine following your daughter's character !!!

Now you can build a tender Lime light or Lemon twist SB, or a custom Panther pink one...

Ya, I am a Maniak !

  • Member since
    July, 2004
  • From: Peoria, AZ
Posted by DARKRAPID on Monday, September 10, 2007 6:37 PM
Here are some more box art pics.


This is the Monogram Superbird kit. Simple but great kit. It has been reissued a few times over the years but not to recently. this kit is 1:24. Ebay would be a good source for one.


Another box for the Johan version. This one is 1:25. Also hard to find but also on ebay.

I prefer the Monogram kit. Expecially for a stock build.

Darkrapid My Photoalbum

Current projects: MPC 72 Camaro SS restoration. 

 

  • Member since
    November, 2006
  • From: Lake Villa, IL
Posted by vwdave92 on Monday, September 10, 2007 8:39 PM
BowBowBowBow

I have to say the above thread is the coolest thing I have ever seen on the internet. Thank you Al Gore for inventing this thing! Wink

Seriously... thanks to all of you who responded. The Monagram kit seems to be plentiful on ebay so I'll probably go that way. I'm going to probably venture into custome Panther Pink or Moulin Rouge since the color was from the right vintage. I will probably also keep the vinyl top as well.

I've been looking for a car to build for my daughter since she was born... no that she has developed more of a personality it just kind of hit me.

Thanks again to all of you... truely an amazing thing!

watch for the build up
Dave

on the bench: Revell 49 Merc... most ambitious project yet...

Support your LHS! Greenfield News and Hobby: Greenfield, WI; Model Empire: West Allis, WI; Ron's Hobbies: Mundelein, IL

  • Member since
    January, 2005
  • From: Thomasville, Ga.
Posted by FreightTrain on Monday, September 10, 2007 11:06 PM
QUOTE: Originally posted by CanCon 1

Here's the box of my Superbird, I think this is the one Jeff,s talking about ,, it also builds stock. I bought this one new in the early '80's. It's well past due for a rebuild ,, with the AMT '68 RR chassis. Big Smile




Thumbs Up Big Smile
~ Jeff Scott ~ "Have You Driven A Ford ... Lately?"
  • Member since
    November, 2003
Posted by MLOMAKA on Tuesday, September 11, 2007 7:27 AM
Thanks Fury. I knew one of them had a vinyl top. I just thopught it was the Daytona since the window had a bigger hole to fill. Also thanks for the paint name. I knew Plymouth called it something different, but I could figure out how to spell "moulin" let alone "Rouge".(LOL) I also have the Jo-han kit Cancon pictured and it is a good looking kit, with noted errors (top and no decals).
But you know what, I think your daughter will be happy with what ever you build her. Keep us posted!
Mike member of Buckeye Scale Auto Club http://community.webshots.com/user/mlomaka http://s5.photobucket.com/albums/y184/mlomaka/ http://www.hubgarage.com/mygarage/mlomaka
  • Member since
    May, 2008
Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, September 11, 2007 9:23 AM
QUOTE: Originally posted by MLOMAKA

Thanks Fury. I knew one of them had a vinyl top. I just thopught it was the Daytona since the window had a bigger hole to fill. Also thanks for the paint name. I knew Plymouth called it something different, but I could figure out how to spell "moulin" let alone "Rouge".(LOL) I also have the Jo-han kit Cancon pictured and it is a good looking kit, with noted errors (top and no decals).
But you know what, I think your daughter will be happy with what ever you build her. Keep us posted!
Smile,Wink, & GrinBlush Fury3

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